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	<title>Comments on: Visio Replacement? You Be the Judge</title>
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	<description>Boxes and Arrows is devoted to the practice, innovation, and discussion of design; including graphic design, interaction design, information architecture and the design of business.</description>
	<lastBuildDate>Mon, 20 May 2013 13:09:05 +0000</lastBuildDate>
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		<title>By: pomade</title>
		<link>http://boxesandarrows.com/visio-replacement-you-be-the-judge/#comment-6039</link>
		<dc:creator>pomade</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 30 Nov -0001 00:00:00 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://boxesandarrows.com/visio-replacement-you-be-the-judge/#comment-6039</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[I think lot of the tools mention above are pretty good tools for simulating websites or webapplications with basic UI interation....but I think they still lack ability to effectively simulate rich internet or desktop applications.....I guess I&#039;m still stuck prototyping with visio, photoshop, snagit, and powerpoint :) 

Note: I&#039;m always little skeptical about these tool vendors who claim to provide solutions to everything.....to me, a good prototyper should be able to use just about anything - long as they could do it fast and get their point across effectively to their audience. I still think paper/pen is still pretty good :)]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I think lot of the tools mention above are pretty good tools for simulating websites or webapplications with basic UI interation&#8230;.but I think they still lack ability to effectively simulate rich internet or desktop applications&#8230;..I guess I&#8217;m still stuck prototyping with visio, photoshop, snagit, and powerpoint <img src='http://www-boxesandarrows-com.zippykid.netdna-cdn.com/wp-includes/images/smilies/icon_smile.gif' alt=':)' class='wp-smiley' />  </p>
<p>Note: I&#8217;m always little skeptical about these tool vendors who claim to provide solutions to everything&#8230;..to me, a good prototyper should be able to use just about anything &#8211; long as they could do it fast and get their point across effectively to their audience. I still think paper/pen is still pretty good <img src='http://www-boxesandarrows-com.zippykid.netdna-cdn.com/wp-includes/images/smilies/icon_smile.gif' alt=':)' class='wp-smiley' /> </p>
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		<title>By: giles</title>
		<link>http://boxesandarrows.com/visio-replacement-you-be-the-judge/#comment-6040</link>
		<dc:creator>giles</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 30 Nov -0001 00:00:00 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://boxesandarrows.com/visio-replacement-you-be-the-judge/#comment-6040</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[Man, I miss HyperCard.]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Man, I miss HyperCard.</p>
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		<title>By: dmalouf</title>
		<link>http://boxesandarrows.com/visio-replacement-you-be-the-judge/#comment-6041</link>
		<dc:creator>dmalouf</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 30 Nov -0001 00:00:00 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://boxesandarrows.com/visio-replacement-you-be-the-judge/#comment-6041</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[Other tool offerings that do &quot;prototyping&quot; (Where in the world did the term &quot;simulators&quot; come from for UX designers?

Adobe Flash/Flex: You can create data sets in XML, and generate real elaborate interactions.

(upcoming)
Microsoft Expression: Interactive Designer: Just like Flash but for WPF/E.

These simulators for the most part--the ones mentioned above--differ from the tools I mention here in that they are also document management systems or have some connectivity to a document.]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Other tool offerings that do &#8220;prototyping&#8221; (Where in the world did the term &#8220;simulators&#8221; come from for UX designers?</p>
<p>Adobe Flash/Flex: You can create data sets in XML, and generate real elaborate interactions.</p>
<p>(upcoming)<br />
Microsoft Expression: Interactive Designer: Just like Flash but for WPF/E.</p>
<p>These simulators for the most part&#8211;the ones mentioned above&#8211;differ from the tools I mention here in that they are also document management systems or have some connectivity to a document.</p>
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		<title>By: fred_beecher</title>
		<link>http://boxesandarrows.com/visio-replacement-you-be-the-judge/#comment-6042</link>
		<dc:creator>fred_beecher</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 30 Nov -0001 00:00:00 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://boxesandarrows.com/visio-replacement-you-be-the-judge/#comment-6042</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[Ji,

I&#039;ve been using Axure for a relatively long while now and I can tell you that there is pretty much no interaction I can&#039;t prototype in that tool outside of drag and drop. There is a lot of facility for making the pages highly interactive without page loads, and this has allowed me to get a good idea of how usable an interaction is before it&#039;s been fully designed. 

Scott, there are a few inaccuracies in your discussion of Axure&#039;s features. First, it does include a facility for creating page flows (scenario design). Admittedly, it&#039;s rudimentary, but it&#039;s been good enough for my purposes. Second, it does allow for limited data interaction. Axure has one page variable that it can play with, and you can make user interactions set the value of this variable. You can then set interactive elements on the page to react to this variable.

Regarding Axure as a Visio replacement, it *has* replaced Visio for me, nearly. The only thing I continue to use Visio for is site maps. And that&#039;s fine with me. : )

One more thing... I think it&#039;s important to note the cost of iRise... while it is a really excellent tool, it costs around $150,000. I&#039;m not kidding and that&#039;s not a typo. My company was looking into that vs. Axure and we contacted a rep who gave us this figure. We are no longer looking at iRise. : )]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Ji,</p>
<p>I&#8217;ve been using Axure for a relatively long while now and I can tell you that there is pretty much no interaction I can&#8217;t prototype in that tool outside of drag and drop. There is a lot of facility for making the pages highly interactive without page loads, and this has allowed me to get a good idea of how usable an interaction is before it&#8217;s been fully designed. </p>
<p>Scott, there are a few inaccuracies in your discussion of Axure&#8217;s features. First, it does include a facility for creating page flows (scenario design). Admittedly, it&#8217;s rudimentary, but it&#8217;s been good enough for my purposes. Second, it does allow for limited data interaction. Axure has one page variable that it can play with, and you can make user interactions set the value of this variable. You can then set interactive elements on the page to react to this variable.</p>
<p>Regarding Axure as a Visio replacement, it *has* replaced Visio for me, nearly. The only thing I continue to use Visio for is site maps. And that&#8217;s fine with me. : )</p>
<p>One more thing&#8230; I think it&#8217;s important to note the cost of iRise&#8230; while it is a really excellent tool, it costs around $150,000. I&#8217;m not kidding and that&#8217;s not a typo. My company was looking into that vs. Axure and we contacted a rep who gave us this figure. We are no longer looking at iRise. : )</p>
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		<title>By: urikochavi</title>
		<link>http://boxesandarrows.com/visio-replacement-you-be-the-judge/#comment-6043</link>
		<dc:creator>urikochavi</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 30 Nov -0001 00:00:00 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://boxesandarrows.com/visio-replacement-you-be-the-judge/#comment-6043</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[My experience is very similar to Fred’s, and I agree with what he said. We too sat in an iRise demo, and the quote we got was 50k to half a mil!!
For my money (well, not really mine..) Axure delivers so much more bang for the buck. Not that iRise is not impressive – and yes, I’d love the DB connectivity + logic and all, but I think Axure nailed the famous 80% of the use cases for 80% of the users, and for the right price. It is, however, primarily for web apps, and when I had to mock up a rich client recently I had to return to Visio  ;-(  
you can simulate some AJAX with it, too.

The best thing about Axure:
very easy to learn and use, I was productive since day 1
the worst thing:
it produces really big HTML files, so try to keep them short]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>My experience is very similar to Fred’s, and I agree with what he said. We too sat in an iRise demo, and the quote we got was 50k to half a mil!!<br />
For my money (well, not really mine..) Axure delivers so much more bang for the buck. Not that iRise is not impressive – and yes, I’d love the DB connectivity + logic and all, but I think Axure nailed the famous 80% of the use cases for 80% of the users, and for the right price. It is, however, primarily for web apps, and when I had to mock up a rich client recently I had to return to Visio  ;-(<br />
you can simulate some AJAX with it, too.</p>
<p>The best thing about Axure:<br />
very easy to learn and use, I was productive since day 1<br />
the worst thing:<br />
it produces really big HTML files, so try to keep them short</p>
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		<title>By: andersramsay</title>
		<link>http://boxesandarrows.com/visio-replacement-you-be-the-judge/#comment-6044</link>
		<dc:creator>andersramsay</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 30 Nov -0001 00:00:00 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://boxesandarrows.com/visio-replacement-you-be-the-judge/#comment-6044</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[Very interesting article.  While I think there certainly is something to be said for simulation tools, I have personal experience with several of these tools, including iRise, which I used for designing enterprise apps as an in-house IA at a multinational. First, re. the price, it does not have to be as high as 150K.  Our package ran about 50K, which still is an astronomical sum (though not necessarily for a multinational or other large corp, which is a key demographic for iRise) - though packages can run up to 250k (which is what I was told Yahoo paid back in the day for an earlier version of the system.)

While iRise in many ways is very powerful, I ultimately found that it&#039;s key value was in being able to rapidly communicate a new concept.  In other words, it worked when part of the early stages of an IKIWISI (I Know It When I See It) requirements gathering model, in which a design was sort of grokked from a set of high-level business requirements, and then I just cranked out a functioning simulation in a day or two, to which stakeholders then responded.  *However*, when the proof of concept phase was completed, and time came to actually get into detailed design, it turned out to be far more effective to just whiteboard stuff and return to doing wireframes (either visio or xhtml or flash or some other combination of tools) in collaboration with designers and developers.  Why?  Well, there are many reasons...

One huge reason was that we found prototyping the functionality in the actual target environment to ultimately be a far beneficial approach.  In doing so, we were not only validating the user experience, but also validating the technology.  

This is maybe an even bigger reason:  at least from my experience, these simulators by and large are not capable of rapidly prototyping ajax functionality or other highly customized interaction design in which things refresh at the element level or animate or whatever, which for me, is an essential component of modern interaction design - for that reason, they may become a constraining factor, since one might only consider design options that the simulator supports.]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Very interesting article.  While I think there certainly is something to be said for simulation tools, I have personal experience with several of these tools, including iRise, which I used for designing enterprise apps as an in-house IA at a multinational. First, re. the price, it does not have to be as high as 150K.  Our package ran about 50K, which still is an astronomical sum (though not necessarily for a multinational or other large corp, which is a key demographic for iRise) &#8211; though packages can run up to 250k (which is what I was told Yahoo paid back in the day for an earlier version of the system.)</p>
<p>While iRise in many ways is very powerful, I ultimately found that it&#8217;s key value was in being able to rapidly communicate a new concept.  In other words, it worked when part of the early stages of an IKIWISI (I Know It When I See It) requirements gathering model, in which a design was sort of grokked from a set of high-level business requirements, and then I just cranked out a functioning simulation in a day or two, to which stakeholders then responded.  *However*, when the proof of concept phase was completed, and time came to actually get into detailed design, it turned out to be far more effective to just whiteboard stuff and return to doing wireframes (either visio or xhtml or flash or some other combination of tools) in collaboration with designers and developers.  Why?  Well, there are many reasons&#8230;</p>
<p>One huge reason was that we found prototyping the functionality in the actual target environment to ultimately be a far beneficial approach.  In doing so, we were not only validating the user experience, but also validating the technology.  </p>
<p>This is maybe an even bigger reason:  at least from my experience, these simulators by and large are not capable of rapidly prototyping ajax functionality or other highly customized interaction design in which things refresh at the element level or animate or whatever, which for me, is an essential component of modern interaction design &#8211; for that reason, they may become a constraining factor, since one might only consider design options that the simulator supports.</p>
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		<title>By: jesperrr</title>
		<link>http://boxesandarrows.com/visio-replacement-you-be-the-judge/#comment-6045</link>
		<dc:creator>jesperrr</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 30 Nov -0001 00:00:00 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://boxesandarrows.com/visio-replacement-you-be-the-judge/#comment-6045</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[For the more technical people I can highly recommend to use Ruby on Rails as a rapid prototyping tool. 

As Anders Ramsay points out, tools like iRise have a hard time in prototyping AJAX functionality. Here Ruby on Rails is the star. Because of the built-in possibilities to easy add autocomplete widgets, drag-n-drop interface and more.

I wrote about how we use it at work on my blog justaddwater.dk:

&lt;a href=&quot;http://justaddwater.dk/2006/04/12/rails-prototyping/&quot; rel=&quot;nofollow&quot;&gt;Justaddwater.dk: Ruby on Rails as a Rapid Prototyping Tool&lt;/a&gt;]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>For the more technical people I can highly recommend to use Ruby on Rails as a rapid prototyping tool. </p>
<p>As Anders Ramsay points out, tools like iRise have a hard time in prototyping AJAX functionality. Here Ruby on Rails is the star. Because of the built-in possibilities to easy add autocomplete widgets, drag-n-drop interface and more.</p>
<p>I wrote about how we use it at work on my blog justaddwater.dk:</p>
<p><a href="http://justaddwater.dk/2006/04/12/rails-prototyping/" rel="nofollow">Justaddwater.dk: Ruby on Rails as a Rapid Prototyping Tool</a></p>
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	<item>
		<title>By: tonant</title>
		<link>http://boxesandarrows.com/visio-replacement-you-be-the-judge/#comment-6046</link>
		<dc:creator>tonant</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 30 Nov -0001 00:00:00 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://boxesandarrows.com/visio-replacement-you-be-the-judge/#comment-6046</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[From my exploration of this area, I would agree Axzure has the best bang for the buck. However my perception is that Composer has the most potential to be a comprehensive simulation through documentation system.

But then AJAX throws a big stick in the works and currently I&#039;m leaning toward Microsoft&#039;s Expression Interactive Designer which from what I&#039;ve seen to date is the most interesting RIA development tool out there. In fact even the Expression Graphic Designer tool is an eye opener - effectively replacing both Illustrator and Photoshop in the one tool (with decent web integration) and currently for free!

Adobe the guys who you would have expected to lead in the simulation space (but have yet to step in) are likely to miss the boat - again :)]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>From my exploration of this area, I would agree Axzure has the best bang for the buck. However my perception is that Composer has the most potential to be a comprehensive simulation through documentation system.</p>
<p>But then AJAX throws a big stick in the works and currently I&#8217;m leaning toward Microsoft&#8217;s Expression Interactive Designer which from what I&#8217;ve seen to date is the most interesting RIA development tool out there. In fact even the Expression Graphic Designer tool is an eye opener &#8211; effectively replacing both Illustrator and Photoshop in the one tool (with decent web integration) and currently for free!</p>
<p>Adobe the guys who you would have expected to lead in the simulation space (but have yet to step in) are likely to miss the boat &#8211; again <img src='http://www-boxesandarrows-com.zippykid.netdna-cdn.com/wp-includes/images/smilies/icon_smile.gif' alt=':)' class='wp-smiley' /> </p>
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		<title>By: lauriegray</title>
		<link>http://boxesandarrows.com/visio-replacement-you-be-the-judge/#comment-6047</link>
		<dc:creator>lauriegray</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 30 Nov -0001 00:00:00 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://boxesandarrows.com/visio-replacement-you-be-the-judge/#comment-6047</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[Great article Scott!

As a former user of Axure and current user of iRise, I think the price point discussions are appropriate and highly necessary. As a solo practitioner in-house, where most everything I did was viewed as 100% overhead, Axure did what I needed it to do and it did it well. The price point at purchase was around $500. We also were not doing a lot of work with RIA&#039;s.

Now that I&#039;m back in the consulting world, I&#039;m fortunate to have access to iRise. It&#039;s much more robust than Axure. My view is that it is the enterprise level equivalent and Axure is more of the smaller shop version.

There are things I could do in Axure that I cannot do in iRise and vice versa. I would imagine that convergence of these tools or the features of these tools will be something to watch in the future.]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Great article Scott!</p>
<p>As a former user of Axure and current user of iRise, I think the price point discussions are appropriate and highly necessary. As a solo practitioner in-house, where most everything I did was viewed as 100% overhead, Axure did what I needed it to do and it did it well. The price point at purchase was around $500. We also were not doing a lot of work with RIA&#8217;s.</p>
<p>Now that I&#8217;m back in the consulting world, I&#8217;m fortunate to have access to iRise. It&#8217;s much more robust than Axure. My view is that it is the enterprise level equivalent and Axure is more of the smaller shop version.</p>
<p>There are things I could do in Axure that I cannot do in iRise and vice versa. I would imagine that convergence of these tools or the features of these tools will be something to watch in the future.</p>
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		<title>By: mhughes</title>
		<link>http://boxesandarrows.com/visio-replacement-you-be-the-judge/#comment-6048</link>
		<dc:creator>mhughes</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 30 Nov -0001 00:00:00 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://boxesandarrows.com/visio-replacement-you-be-the-judge/#comment-6048</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[Good article, Scott. I too am in the Axure camp because what I really need is a wireframe/mid-fidelity prototyping tool. I think it is a good gateway tool to some of the more robust requirements management tools discussed in this article. I have found with Axure, that I must have external ways to link my designs back to requirements and to use case elaborations. Tools like i-rise seem pricey if compared to Visio and Axure, but it must be compared to fuller requirments management suites, such as Rationale.]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Good article, Scott. I too am in the Axure camp because what I really need is a wireframe/mid-fidelity prototyping tool. I think it is a good gateway tool to some of the more robust requirements management tools discussed in this article. I have found with Axure, that I must have external ways to link my designs back to requirements and to use case elaborations. Tools like i-rise seem pricey if compared to Visio and Axure, but it must be compared to fuller requirments management suites, such as Rationale.</p>
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